Supercharger model

[mynameisowen]

Very interesting, presumably you would have to increase the alternator spec and/or battery. How much power would the electric motor create (compressor)?

[archyman]

As you can imagine that depends.. But i guess at least 70 % of the speed of any regular turbo.
The turbo spins to 100 000 rpm and more..the EM can make 60, 70.
Fiddling with the compressor size and design makes the difference and i don't need it to be smaller in order to spool fast. This technology requires under 350ms to full speed.
So far the problem with this idea is the lack of such motors and controllers on the general market...
Yes the battery must be changed, maybe the generator also.
The future is in electricity you know

[sktaroins]

capacity of compression rate for every engine is either calculated or determined by how much we burn

the formula says it has to be balanced for an engine to run.

meaning - if we had an em and change battery and alternator - here we are increasing electrical flow and the movement flow of our engines.

what iam trying to say is everything should be balanced, if em increased the compression the burning should increase if you want more speed but you cant have higher speed just by burning alot of fuel - yes that's true but also need pumping power of your pistons to do the stroke..

bio fuel and electrical is the way to the future .
here i cant write alot about this because there is too much to take abt

engine capacity
size of the em
size of the intake
everything matters

maybe the focus in any build should be towards one goal either power or speed - i choose speed over power.
for example my goal is to hit atleast 320km/h far fetched for my civic lol but its my goal

[archyman]

Hey,
it's not hard reaching 320, we just need a downhill long and steep enough..kidding
Nothing is impossible man, the speed will be a proprotional function of the size of your wallet if you know what mean
In order to work, this idea has to rely on the point that the energy used will be less than the energy generated.
And i have to calculate the losses somehow to see if the idea can be efficient.
With so many engineers in this forum, i am suprised that no one can help me on finding a decent electric motor for my compressor application
Cheers!

[mynameisowen]

Hey I'm a mechanical engineer!

[archyman]

Owen, you are my hope then!
Since you are from UK, you can actually help me contact the firms that produce such devices there... I've tried with emails but got no answer.
Since the project is not a secret, i think it can be a benefit for all of us if we make it after all .
There is a firm called "Nidec" located in Beckwithshaw, North Yorkshire HG3 1PR that is producing especially SR drives.
I will try to contact them via email once again.
What is your opinion, is there any other electric motor type capable of delivering above 50 000 rpm with 12v system.. I had conversation with one friend from BMW constructor team, and he said that they use permanent magnet motors for their EV's.
Well any info or suggestions will be appreciated!
Cheers!

[mynameisowen]

I said I was a Mechanical Engineer not an Electrical one!

hahahahaha

But if you dont hear back from anyone or want me to contact someone for you please send me information and the email you want sent and I'll do what I can.

Sorry I can't help further though.

[archyman]

Don't worry, i understand that it's a challenge, just ask asking if you have an idea
The mentioned firm didn't answer, so I'll have to look for motor elsewhere.

[SquirtAndSpark]

The electronic one recived a pm

Sorry archyman, but my field is in telecommunications, the "energy" guys are the ones how understand about motors... but far as I know, there are a type of motor that keeps always accelerating and if it does not have any type of load (mechanical) it will burn itself. maybe that's the type that you mentioned before...

anyway I can see some disadvantages, if you use a turbo, the wasted pressure gases are use, but if you plan to use a electrical motor, the the power needed makes a load on the alternator and consequently load on the engine (like a supercharger). the electrical to mechanical conversion is not 100% efficient. for example a alternator 80% efficient and a EM 90% efficient and a motor controller 90% efficient you only will get 0.8*0.9*0.9~= 65% of the energy that you waste. I believe that a turbo will be more efficient.


for that type of engine response that you want I recommend it's a sequential turbo solution. first use a small turbo that spolls very well at low rpm. after that the exhaust output and westgate of this turbo connects to a second bigger turbo with a better air flow. it some kind of actuator on the intake side we can choose the one that will boost the engine. I hope you can understand the idea

[archyman]

Welcome over
Actually the speed is controllable via the em management unit.
About the drawbacks:
I agree that there will be losses, but i suggest that the losses are there also with the belt driven compressors. As I've mentioned some of them could draw up to 100bhp.
The benefit of em over the latter is the capability to boost the torq and hp from very low engine rpm, so less need of constant shifting to get power, and better fuel economy for smaller engines compared to large ones with similar power.
I am familiar with the sequential turbo apps, but they are even harder to build and maintain.
Thanks man, will have this in mind!
It had been done before, so it must be doable and reasonable
Cheers!